On the "Wake & Bake" Plan?

[Manx]

I have observed a rider smoking dope during stops on a ride (at Mother's and at the Santa Ysabel gas station). We weren't riding together, but I see him regularly at the "usual" places.

Do you smoke dope and ride? Do you think it's okay to do so?

[Rocko]

what kinda bike where they on? did they have gear?

that foo is retarded.

[jen]

Originally posted by Rocko
that foo is retarded.

http://www.socalsvriders.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=237041#post237041

[Zombiesai]

Once... once I did it. and It was not fun for the most part...


Being a long time "Baker" I have a tendancy to......well...space out. which needless to say, on a motorcycle is BAD. And even if nothing comes of it, as soon as I realize that I have been spacing out...enjoying the wind, or simply enjoying the ride, as soon as I snap out of it...It startles me, and makes me very edgy for a long time so that I remain focused on the task of not getting my dumb ass killed.

Driving a car is no problem. Motorcyclists, however have far too much to pay attention to, and too many variables to constantly keep track of.

and at the end I was just exhausted from working so hard to maintain full alertness (regardless of the relative necessity to be fully alert)

[Setter32]

...:lol: ....

...Rocko only smokes dope........before a ride.............not during....

...

....back to this retard...

.....if the group didn't dump him.......after seeing that.......

.....I would have left the group....








:D

[Manx]

Originally posted by Setter32
.....if the group didn't dump him.......after seeing that.......

.....I would have left the group....

As far as I could tell......he was alone.....



....Fancy that....






:D

[HoolieB]

Maybe he uses it for medicinal purposes, you know, for glaucoma or chemotherapy relief. Yeah, that's the ticket.


:D

[Mohawk]

Originally posted by Zombiesai

Driving a car is no problem.





Originally posted by Rocko


that foo is retarded.

[NukleoN]

Do you smoke dope and ride? Do you think it's okay to do so?

No and No. I include tobacco in the mix, for the record. If you're smoking at all, you're smoking dope. ;)

Like I always say, I am a second-hand smoker, but I am trying to quit.

[Setter32]

Originally posted by Manx
As far as I could tell......he was alone.....



....Fancy that....






:D


....you're creepy....








:|

[poopoohead]

i was a regular then i smoked once when i first got my bike...then i tried ride home........................couldnt do it......i pulled over and sat on the curb for about an hour b4 i got back up and rode home.
havent smoked since then.


but i just sold my bike sooooooo.................







j/k

[Manx]

Originally posted by Setter32
....you're creepy....

Success! :groove:

[sandie]

well quoted mohawk

ya ask me, all you stoners are delusional if you think yer "ok to drive" when you're high...ya'll appear to drive about as well as you're average drunk leaving the bar at 2am on a saturday night to us sober folk. it's scary to me that anyone thinks it's ok to drive OR ride drunk OR stoned. i mean, i'm as guilty as the next guy of THINKING i'm ok to drive when i'm not on occasion...but seriously stoners, ya'll need to get a clue on this one ;)

[luckyphil]

I'm afraid I am occasionaly guilty of such indescretions(waiting for bombardment of criticism).... Judging from the previous repliesto this thread so far, I think I might get seriously flamed over my statement....let's see:rolleyes:

[Rocko]

it's okay to do it in australia because you're not gonna run over my kid.

[Dante]

Originally posted by Jennifer
http://www.socalsvriders.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=237041#post237041

LMAO very clever Jennifer.

I'm spastic enough sober and alert. I don't need help being a :squid:

[Dr. D]

It's OK to smoke and drive. Just don't go through the drive-thru to get some munchies, some stupid kid might jump out in front of your car or bike.

The statement above was a joke. You should never be under the influence while riding or driving. At the very minimum, if you get pulled over you are fucked.

[aweesan]

I think I'd kick someone's ass if I knew they were doing that. Wait, I KNOW I'd kick their ass. As someone who's seen many "mop up on Aisle 9" collisions, just do us a favor: if you have a death wish, just keep it to yourself and don't involve innocent people on the roads-- because we all know that the ones who are baked with any kind of substance, alcohol or whatever-- are the ones who survive the collisions unfortunately. I hope you die a thousand painful deaths, if not in this lifetime then in the nether regions or in subsequent lives until you learn "operating transportation equipment while intoxicated is bad, mmmkay?"

Bake, do what you will, at home, just keep it off the streets. That is the most unfair thing to do to anyone.

[stingray]

i make sure i'm not on any drugs if i'm going to ride. unless it's caffeine and it's only if i need a little boost to keep me going when i'm racing. need to keep my wits if i'm to keep it rubberside down.

i'm not a W&B guy but have "partaked" of mind altering substances.

btw, when did marijuana become "dope?" :confused:

[racinteach]

never touched the stuff and have little respect for those that light up and drive or ride...but fuuny thing when I use to race downhill mtb's they use to light up before their races...they rode great ...I think or they just did not feel the pain when they crashed..

[Manx]

Originally posted by stingray
btw, when did marijuana become "dope?" :confused:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dope :dunno:

[summitsix]

Nah, don't touch the stuff. Dr D is right, get pulled over and at best, you'll be demoted to riding a bicycle.

Worst case, you'll kill or harm an innocent victim who won't see whats coming.

When I'm at a stoplight, I sometimes get the creeps when I see someone coming in hot in the side mirrors, man I don't want to go out like that.

[smocohiba]

Originally posted by racinteach
never touched the stuff and have little respect for those that light up and drive or ride...but fuuny thing when I use to race downhill mtb's they use to light up before their races...they rode great ...I think or they just did not feel the pain when they crashed..

yah...downhill MTB and weed seem to go well together. Possibly because the performance gain from the anxiety reduction offsets the reductions in motor control and judgement.

Not that I speak from personal experience or anything >ahem<:angel:

[GreenAgain]

Originally posted by racinteach
never touched the stuff and have little respect for those that light up and drive or ride...but fuuny thing when I use to race downhill mtb's they use to light up before their races...they rode great ...I think or they just did not feel the pain when they crashed..



So what you're saying is that you have no respect for the stoners because they kicked your ass in downhill mtb races?:sad:

[sandie]

i want to clarify my earlier statement by saying i have no problem with people partaking in whatever recreational substances they so choose to...my substance of choice is wine :D i jsut think it's laughable how pot smokers seem to think driving drunk is horrible, but they're perfectly ok to drive (or do anything) while totally baked. silly stoners ;)

[jen]

At least there's a good chance that if they did crash they'd be going BELOW the speed limit..."just cruisin' dude" ;)

[aweesan]

.. I don't understand shy it is that so many people have to smoke it to "enjoy" anything. I mean that even on the slopes you have these boarders who are doing some crazy downhill stuff -- snowboarding in and of itself is sooo fun, yet they really need a doob to "enjoy" themselves out there? How could you not without it?! Especially when people's creedo nowadays seems to "just be real". You're not really being yourself doing it and run the risk of seriously hurting others in the process. Really, I'm sure there is a time and a place, but when traveling at fast speeds with innocent people around, it's not the time.

[Zombiesai]

I didn't want to enter this debate...for sure it was going to become one...but now of course ignorance has reared its head.


Do one thing for me before you condemn others actions....

Try it first with an open mind. Go think about it for a week. Then come back and tell me how you feel about it.

[rbuzaleski]

You don't have to try to try it when you can see its effects on others. One of its effects is to impair the judgement of the user, so when you tell us you rode high but were fine and didn't do anything dangerous, we know not to trust your assessment.

I'm with the poster that said they'd kick the ass of anyone they caught riding/driving impaired. You wanna do it, do it on your own closed track or out alone on the salt flats or something. Don't risk people who haven't had a say in whether they want to accept that risk.

We're tryin' to have a society here.

[racinteach]

Originally posted by Zombiesai
I didn't want to enter this debate...for sure it was going to become one...but now of course ignorance has reared its head.


Do one thing for me before you condemn others actions....

Try it first with an open mind. Go think about it for a week. Then come back and tell me how you feel about it.

no thanks..

[o4trix]

Can't we all just get along? One love people...:D

[aweesan]

Originally posted by Zombiesai
I didn't want to enter this debate...for sure it was going to become one...but now of course ignorance has reared its head.


I'd really think twice about 'rearing the ignorance head' at others when, if you're the one endangering others out there, then it's your face that's staring back at you in that mirror. Dude, I care less about what you feel you need to do, as long as you don't hurt or endanger others. Capice? An open mind is also not losing sight of your actions having dire consequences for others. For someone not to consider that is pretty selfish and closed-minded.

Do one thing for me before you condemn others actions....Try it first with an open mind. Go think about it for a week. Then come back and tell me how you feel about it.

Really, we are doing you a favor, telling you to keep that off the bike. You're on a motorcycle site where many of us know each other and ride together on a daily basis. You hurt my friends with careless selfish actions, and you can bet I'd have a bone to pick with you. I'd do that for any friend.

[poopoohead]

oh and one other thing its still not "ok" if youve been habitualy smoking since the age of 2 and have become immune to the effects of THC.

[HoolieB]

Originally posted by o4trix
Can't we all just get along? One love people...:D

Yeah, let's all join hands and pass around the peace-pipe, mmmkay?
:p

So, seriously, because I am ignorant vis-a-vis DUI stats, does anyone know the percentages of collisions and fatalities where cannibis was the culprit?

Oh, one final note: thanks to this thread, I cannot for the life of me get Pato Banton's "Don't Sniff Coke" song out of my head. :lalala:

[blndweasel]

Okay let's take the downhill MTB'er or the snowboarder as an example. One of the main effects of cannabis is vasodialation. This means increased blood flow to the brain (assuming you are in good cardiovascular health, and well hydrated). Increased blood flow has a net effect of increasing capacity for information processing. This means as objects are hurtling past the sportsman at incredible speed, it's easier for them to get "in the zone" as they might say, to where information can be processed perhiperally... i.e. from Keith Code's Twist of the Wrist , being able to look at the road/track and instead of focusing on all of your reference points individually, processing them all at once.

Now this isn't something you pick up in an afternoon. It takes training, experience, and motivation to advance your skills in the particular sport of your choice.

Recall from the most recent winter Olympics, the champion Canadian snowboarder who tested positive and had to turn in his medals. When people watched him perform on TV, do you think people said "WOW look at that guy, he must be totally blazed" ?!? No, they said, "holy crap that was amazing".

The point here, is that fully functional members of society exist all around you that probably smoke and you don't even know it. These are people that respect the drug and it's effects on the body, and are experienced enough to not get themselves into situations they can't handle. The thing is, you'll never know it.

There will always be people who do stupid stuff... like the guy lighting up at mothers, or at the gas station (smoking anything at a gas station is instant eligibility for a darwin award). And there's little excuse for that.

It's kind of like riding... there is a minority of riders who act irresponsibly (i.e. wheelies on freeway) and end up giving a bad name for all other riders from the average member of society's perspective. Taking that example into consideration, ask yourself this: Don't you hate it when people sterotype all riders as irresponsible?

With that in mind, ask yourself if you're stereotyping all people who smoke cannabis. If you answered yes to the previous two questions, then congratulations: you're a hypocrite.

[rbuzaleski]

Except that a) other effects of cannabis are to make you act slow and goofy and impair your judgement, which offsets any gain from increased bloodflow, and b) if you're doing it on a bike, and it takes pratice, then unless you did all your practice on a closed track and never "practiced" by smoking up and riding on the same roads I use before you were an expert who would be no risk (righhhhhhhhhht) to me, then you still deserve an ass-beating for risking me.

The guy who gets enough positive effect from cannabis to make him a better sportsman _is_ the exception. It isn't the norm.

[illustr8dman]

I'm completely useless when I smoke weed and would never think about getting on the bike and going somewhere. However ....I saw one study ....done privately ....in Europe I think, where volenters smoked and drank on a closed course after completeing it sober. Those that drank did worse. The ones who smoked, if they made a mistake while sober, actually improved.

[Mohawk]

Originally posted by Zombiesai
I didn't want to enter this debate...for sure it was going to become one...but now of course ignorance has reared its head.


Do one thing for me before you condemn others actions....

Try it first with an open mind. Go think about it for a week. Then come back and tell me how you feel about it.


Who reared the head of ignorance might I ask?

I myself was a hard core stoner for a long time, another story, but still will admit that smoking MJ will does decrease your reflexes. No matter how long you have been smoking, time of day, how much coffee you have had or anything else will make me think other wise. So in that at, at least for myself, I have tried it with a open (cloudy) mind and still feel one should not drive any motorized vehicle on public roads while stoned, drunk, or even meds.

Too think that the numerous clinical trials on the effects of MJ do not apply to you is.....ignorant.

And before you take this as an attack Zombie, the only reason anyone is saying anything against your response is because we all care about you as a fellow rider and don't want to see you get hurt or you hurt anyone else. Remember one thing too, if you run someone down and kill them while intoxicated.......you get vehicular manslaughter.....which I believe is about 5 years of your life taken for a doobie, dope, MJ or whatever else we are calling it.

[GreenAgain]

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

Years ago Car & Driver magazine did a drunk driving test, and you all can guess what the results were.

A year later they did the same test with people smoking pot, and only after the 4th, or 5th joint did their test results show any negative affect. YMMV

[HoolieB]

Timely newspaper article:

(Please note the last name of the second co-author. :raise: )

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/20051115-9999-1n15crops.html

[blndweasel]

Originally posted by rbuzaleski
Except that a) other effects of cannabis are to make you act slow and goofy and impair your judgement, which offsets any gain from increased bloodflow, and b) if you're doing it on a bike, and it takes pratice, then unless you did all your practice on a closed track and never "practiced" by smoking up and riding on the same roads I use before you were an expert who would be no risk (righhhhhhhhhht) to me, then you still deserve an ass-beating for risking me.

The guy who gets enough positive effect from cannabis to make him a better sportsman _is_ the exception. It isn't the norm.

Okay, time for another example...

Driver A has a beer at his local bar, and drives home. He gets there in one piece, didn't endanger other drivers, and wasn't a disturbance in general. The effects of his small dose included a warm feeling in his stomach, a greater tendency to sing along to bad songs on the radio, and a smile on his face.

Driver B has six beers at his local bar, and drives home. He gets into an accident on the way home and kills an innocent pedestrian. He endangered others, and was a disturbance. The effects of his dose were blurred vision, poor depth perception, loss of sensation in the extremities, low blood pressure.

True = both drivers used alcohol.

False = all drivers who use alcohol are irresponsible.

The above example shows how different doses of a drug (in this case ethanol) can have drastically different effects on people. Same thing goes for cannabis. I never suggested taking a rip out of a 5L gravity bong and hopping on a motorcycle.

Do you think smoking weed is bad just because it's illegal? Or did you try it and have a bad experience? Please share...

There's another problem. Ask people to share their experiences with marijuana and you won't get straight answers. In a society that's goverened by a socially conservative majority who censors and litigates against cultural practices they don't understand or agree with, people are reluctant to step up and share the truth. Statistics on usage, as well as traffic accident reports are seriously skewed because of this fact.

Of course you're going to hear about every person who got stoned and crashed their car into a telephone pole. But you won't ever hear about the guy who drove home without incident. He's afraid that if he speaks the truth, the government will take away the one thing that helps him overcome social anxiety, or indigestion, or the painful side effects of chemotherapy, or HIV, or any number of other things.

This argument could go on forever... shall we add more wood to the fire?

[Rocko]

Originally posted by blndweasel
Recall from the most recent winter Olympics, the champion Canadian snowboarder who tested positive and had to turn in his medals. When people watched him perform on TV, do you think people said "WOW look at that guy, he must be totally blazed" ?!? No, they said, "holy crap that was amazing".


Just because he won doesn't mean he did better than he would've if he was sober.

If weed is such a performance enhancing drug, why don't all atheletes use it? Why don't NASA scientists use it when they're trying to figure out what blew up the space shuttle? Why don't surgeons use it to enhance their dexterity and awareness?

The answer is, it doesn't help, it hinders.

Also, since you truly believe it helps enhance performance, i'm sure you'd rather the captain of the airplane you're flying on, the doctor transplanting your heart, or anyone else responsible for your life/safety be a little high than being sober, right?

Weed is good for one thing. Making you high. I'm not against people using it responsibly, but using it in a car is irresponsible, dude.

[enos79]

Anyone seen the TV show "5th Gear"? I saw an episode a while back in which they wanted to see who drove better, someone seriously intoxicated from alcohol, someone seriously stoned from weed, or a driver with neither in his system. They ran each driver through a series of tests, emergency lanes changes, parallel parking, emergency braking, etc. What was interesting was that the stoned driver did almost as well as the normal driver, although much slower. The drunk driver just creamed everything, total failure. They concluded that the weed probably had severe adverse effects on the driver, but it made him very paranoid and extremely cautious behind the wheel, so he drove well, just extremely slow. They werent condoning either, but it was interesting to see the results. Obviously riding a motorcycle is much more active than driving a car so the two cant really be compared, and I personally think neither should be abused and then operate a moving vehicle on a public street. But I thought it was an interesting test. Just my .02

[sandie]

i don't know who you people are calling hypocritical.

all i'm sayin is i've smoked a lot of ganja in my lifetime, and i know i drive better when i'm not stoned, just like i drive better when i'm not drunk. i have a lot of friends who smoke a lot, and i know they drive like shit when their stoned, just like they drive like shit when they're drunk.

again, i find it hilarious that people who do smoke weed think that it has absolutely NO effects on their driving ability (my shitty driving stoned friends think this too, you're not alone, i assure you)...now THATS just delusional.

where is the hypocrisy in that?

[aweesan]

I'm certainly not advocating for or against it in general. Sincerely, one cannot expect that they will be Valentino Rossi after being under the influence. Why risk it and others? Like I said, do it as you wish, but NOT where the risk factor raises the chances to harm others.

[HoolieB]

Originally posted by enos79
(snip) They concluded that the weed probably had severe adverse effects on the driver, but it made him very paranoid and extremely cautious behind the wheel, so he drove well, just extremely slow. (snip)

Holy hemorrhoids! That's IT! Each time I've been riding, I've been stoned but just didn't know it!

:p

[sandie]

that tom's been slippin you mary jane instead of ruffies!

[HoolieB]

Originally posted by sandie
that tom's been slippin you mary jane instead of ruffies!

Totally! This explains soooooo much.
;) :D

[rbuzaleski]

Blndweasel:

If the guy in your example who had one beer doesn't normally sing along with the radio a lot, or the beer changes his behavior in any other way, his single beer probably _has_ impaired him, and he doesn't have the right to risk me just because he wanted to get a buzz somewhere other than at home.

Personally, I'm not conservative. If you have to label me, call me Libertarian, although I'm not registered with any party. I think all drugs should be legal. I don't think it's objectively "bad" to smoke a joint or drop some acid or do any other drug. I think it's stupid that in some places you can get in more trouble for breaking a law while high or drunk than while sober. Same act should net same penalty.

Basically, I think you should be able to swing your fist in any way you want until it gets close to my nose. When you ride or drive impaired, you risk me without asking. You take away _my_ freedom. So stop bitching about freedom and hypocrisy. You've demonstrated that you only believe in the former when it suits you, and that like anyone else, you're capable of being the latter.

Also, that other poster was right. I don't care if we don't see eye to eye on this issue; I don't want to see a post on the front page here that says you had an off that killed you.

[sandie]

WELL SAID!

[bloodclot]

Originally posted by blndweasel
One of the main effects of cannabis is vasodialation. This means increased blood flow to the brain (assuming you are in good cardiovascular health, and well hydrated). Increased blood flow has a net effect of increasing capacity for information processing. This means as objects are hurtling past the sportsman at incredible speed, it's easier for them to get "in the zone"

where the hell did you get that information from, High Times Magazine??

if it actually has the effect of "increasing capacity for information processing", then why are there so many burnt out stoners who cant make change at a mcdonalds drive through without the aid of the calculator on their register?

and dont even try to tell me that i am making vague generalizations or perpetuation stereotypes. i know not everyone abuses marijuana to the point of being a burn out. but to claim that it actually makes your brain work better is just plain retarded.

weed may not be as bad as the government attempts to portray it at times, but it sure as hell has no place behind the wheel.

[NukleoN]

Try it first with an open mind. Go think about it for a week. Then come back and tell me how you feel about it.

It's all a matter of degree. I have personal experience with the aforementioned agent, but would not and could not drive 'on' said narcotic. I remember looking in the rearview mirror and forgetting what I saw...or not caring enough to remember...it was unpleasant...yep....it was silly of me to even try (flame on) but I didn't drive...and come to think of it..I didn't even care whether I went out or not...I was too giggly over just about anything.

I agree that there are shades of gray here. Driving 'under the influence' doesn't simply apply to alcohol or pot...it could be a prescription drug or even extreme sleep deprivation which causes a similar serious accident....and law does allow for a certain established level of chemical influence it deems reasonably safe whilst operating a car...otherwise, the legal limit for alcohol would be 0.0, right?

So yeah...*some* people might be able to drive stoned better than some people can drive sober (I don't have a hard time believing that). Some people drive well with 1 beer or perhaps better than a stressed out sober person..(anger is a very real factor in bad driving as well). However, the legal guidelines are set so that we don't simply leave the judgement completely in the hands of those who drive. Those same people smoking a doob behind the wheel could very well be the same types of people who drive like crap when sober coz they're too busy reading a newspaper, putting on makeup, yapping on a cell phone with one hand fully occupied (I will never understand why people don't use headsets more), etc. Bonus points to the cell phone yapper if they're gesturing with the free hand (oh yes, I've seen it...and the car was oncoming and coming toward ME). Ew.

In any event...we gotta draw the line somewhere...but I agree there is some hypocrisy going on and it's not just from individuals but from the state itself. While smoking tobacco certainly isn't going to impair someone's driving like pot, it KILLS people...more than all other drugs combined (and you can thrown in homocides, suicides, AIDS and traffic fatalities combined as well). That's the 900 lb. gorilla, but that's another matter entirely.

In any event...I think we should decriminalize Cannibus (and other narcs) and then establish what the legal limit would be for operating machinery (including a car). Some narcs may never be ok for use with a vehicle...but either way...it's not black and white.

[Zombiesai]

whoa......Ok there are way too many responses for me to comprehend right now....**COUGH**COUGH** SO I'll say this.....you all make valid points, you have clearly thought this out. But your all completely worng and I'm right forever into perpetuity.

of course....a portion of this is farcical, but seriously I won't expend my precious unprescribed medicinal drug smoking time, in an act of futility...have fun folks!

[Rocko]

Thanks for settling the debate! I better go out and buy some quick, because I have to pick up my son from school soon and I want to be the best driver I can possibly be....get the blood flowin to the brain, etc...

[blndweasel]

Originally posted by bloodclot
where the hell did you get that information from, High Times Magazine??

if it actually has the effect of "increasing capacity for information processing", then why are there so many burnt out stoners who cant make change at a mcdonalds drive through without the aid of the calculator on their register?

and dont even try to tell me that i am making vague generalizations or perpetuation stereotypes. i know not everyone abuses marijuana to the point of being a burn out. but to claim that it actually makes your brain work better is just plain retarded.

weed may not be as bad as the government attempts to portray it at times, but it sure as hell has no place behind the wheel.

I want to point out that I'm simply debating for the sake of it here. I'm not advocating drug use. I'm simply trying to point out the fallacies in people's arguments here. Consider me a patriot for open-mindedness, if you will... plus i'm bored at work, and this is more entertaining than minesweeper (albeit marginally).

My information does not come from high times magazine, no. If you'd like me to send you information about specific scientific papers, I can track them down. Search scholar.google.com for "delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol receptor binding effects" and you'll probably find something interesting (if you can stomach mundane scientific writings). Brief synopsis: Cannabinoid receptors exist throughout the central nervous system, and D-9-THC binds to them all. It directly stimulates nerves in the brain, as well as opens up blood flow which has noticable systemic effects. Like I said, under *certain conditions* it can have beneficial effects. It may sound retarded, but it's true.

I'd imagine most burn-outs probably end up that way because they start getting into the stuff at an early age. Back when I was in school, it was easy to tell that the kids who went down to the river and smoked before class ended up never graduating, never going to college, and never making it anywhere in life. Amotivational syndrome is what it's called, and cannabis definitely contributes to it. As well as chronic bronchitis, and about a dozen other upper respiratory infections. Don't get me wrong, the stuff is bad... when it's smoked. Just like anything's bad when it's smoked. But the effects of the chemical vary depending on dosage, just like any other chemical.

---

Hypocrisy and stereotyping are everywhere in our society. We should stomp them out like embers of a fire that have drifted off into the underbrush of a dry forest.

Originally posted by NukleoN
In any event...I think we should decriminalize Cannibus (and other narcs) and then establish what the legal limit would be for operating machinery (including a car). Some narcs may never be ok for use with a vehicle...but either way...it's not black and white.

You're right, it's not black and white, and that was my point. Unfortunately it's impossible to set limits and standards on something such as how "high" a person is.

With alcohol, it's relatively accurate to say 1 shot = 1 beer = 1 glass of wine, and if you've had more than a certain number, based on weight, that you are probably over the limit. Marijuana however varies in potency, so you can't say it's okay to take two puffs and drive because it's impossible to tell how much is in the person's system.

Originally posted by Rocko
Thanks for settling the debate! I better go out and buy some quick, because I have to pick up my son from school soon and I want to be the best driver I can possibly be....get the blood flowin to the brain, etc...

<SARCASM>Where is it, next to the benadryl on aisle four?...</SARCASM>

If you were experienced enough to accurately dose yourself, and had a reason to do so (i.e. you just got done with chemotherapy and can't stop vomiting bile) then maybe you should. But if you're that sick, you could probably convince someone else to go pick up your son.

[Rocko]

seriously, if it could enhance your performance you'd think the military would figure out a way for accurate dosing and get the soldiers all high n shit....

[blndweasel]

that would be pretty funny. the only trouble would be the amotivational factor.

Sargeant: "Private, I want you to go take out that enemy bunker!"

Private: "Awww, come on sarge... I'm trying to beat Jimmy's high score in Tony Hawk... tell you what, I'll take care of it later... hey can I have some more MREs?... and some funyuns... oh, and water... a whole lot of water."

[kc1717]

im totally not against it, and it may increase blood flow, but it hinders reaction time....

[Dragonhawk]

How much you wanna bet that most of these people who think it is okay to ride high are all single males under 30 with crewcuts?

[Manx]

The number in favor of smoking/riding is higher (heh) than I expected...

[luckyphil]

Maybe they are not neccessarily in favour of it, but just not so way way against it as some....I wonder how they would be if they were cops...real nazis probably...an open mind, folks. We are all members on this site because we love riding our sv's,....well those that ride them anyway...what a can of worms you have opened Manx, and to think I only checked out the thread cause of your name(Ihave a soft spot for Nortons, going way back).:cool:

[Manx]

Originally posted by luckyphil
...what a can of worms you have opened Manx, and to think I only checked out the thread cause of your name(Ihave a soft spot for Nortons, going way back).:cool:

You'll notice that the original posting and the poll questions don't display bias. I was (and am) interested to find out what the prevailing opinions are among respondents. Now I know. :)

Oh, and you have a fine eye for screennames... ;)

[HoolieB]

I think this thread opened up a wonderful give-and-take of opinion. And it stayed civil. That's a beautiful thing.

[bloodclot]

Originally posted by Dragonhawk
How much you wanna bet that most of these people who think it is okay to ride high are all single males under 30 with crewcuts?

im not sure that i get what you mean with this post. is it sarcasm, or are you being serious? because if you are being serious, that comment doesnt make much sense to me.

could you please elaborate?

[blndweasel]

I think he's implying that everyone who rides high must not have anything in their life they feel responsible for (i.e. family) therefore they're probably young males, and since they smoke weed all the time they're too lazy to do things like take showers, so instead of having funky smelling hair all the time (besides, dreadlocks don't fit under a helmet), they all get crew-cuts. Problem solved!

See, stereotyping is fun... it's so easy to do, and you will ALWAYS end up pissing somebody off! yay!

[Mohawk]

Originally posted by aweesan
.. I don't understand shy it is that so many people have to smoke it to "enjoy" anything. I mean that even on the slopes you have these boarders who are doing some crazy downhill stuff -- snowboarding in and of itself is sooo fun, yet they really need a doob to "enjoy" themselves out there? How could you not without it?! Especially when people's creedo nowadays seems to "just be real". You're not really being yourself doing it and run the risk of seriously hurting others in the process. Really, I'm sure there is a time and a place, but when traveling at fast speeds with innocent people around, it's not the time.


Speaking for myself only here. Its not that you have to smoke a doob to enjoy things in life, its sometimes it makes an already enjoyable activity that much better.

If I might ask, do you drink? Do you need it to have fun? I am guessing you'll answer yes to the first and no to the second question, so then....why drink at all (that is if you drink).

I will agree though, at high rates of speed around unsuspecting victims, there is no need for it. I have no problems with people that have death wishes, just as long as they have them over there.

[bloodclot]

Originally posted by blndweasel
I think he's implying that everyone who rides high must not have anything in their life they feel responsible for (i.e. family) therefore they're probably young males, and since they smoke weed all the time they're too lazy to do things like take showers, so instead of having funky smelling hair all the time (besides, dreadlocks don't fit under a helmet), they all get crew-cuts. Problem solved!

See, stereotyping is fun... it's so easy to do, and you will ALWAYS end up pissing somebody off! yay!

yea, thats what i was guessing too. but what threw me off was the crewcut thing. is there an official pot smoker haircut that i dont know about ? :confused:

that just snagged my attention because (being military) most people i know fit into the described category, but definitely do not subscribe to that particular theory.

[Grikl]

I think weed is good shit, i would rather have retards riding around stoned than drunk.

I wish people wouldent drive with any mind altering chemical weed, beer, testosterone, pride, menstral cycle, depression, a few more but overall they do the same thing affect your better judgement. I would like to squeese in talking on a cell but It's not mind altering errr

all and all I think I will keep my mouth shut about what i think people should do, and not do, or I my find myself after a while telling people they cannot eat a hamburger cuz its bad for their health.....
and yes that would affect me because that fat fuck had a heart attack on the freeway and steeared right into my bike I crashed and the wall cut my leg off and that fat mother fucker walked away from it with points taken from him 0_o

...........

[chrissilverm]

i wasnt going to respond to this thread because drug use can be a polarizing topic, but i finally had to chime in. let me make a few points. first i understand the difference FOR ME between drinking alcohol and using marijuana. i do not drink and ride. period. drinking is not really my sport, although i do drink. in addition, i actually have a clinical prescription for medical marijuana, and i use it responsibly and legally. it is actually not illegal to ride (or drive,) after using marijuana, only to be under the influence. that basicly means failing a police sobriety test, the physical part, there is obviously no breathalyzer. let me also say that knowing my limitations is key. sometimes i will take a nice ride in the country, and i will smoke and ride, and i ride fine. some of you may argue this point, but marijuana may affect you differently. sometimes i will want to rip a canyon and sobriety and mental agility are key. i also dont buy the argument that all people who use marijuana are losers or stupid. i know many executives, professionals, scholars, intellectuals, artists even a few cops who all enjoy using marijuana. dont get me wrong, there are also a lot of losers too! but i use marijuana almost everyday, and it has never been a problem, i have a great job, a nice apartment, a nice car, and hell, i even got me this nice SV.

what was i saying? damn canabinoids.

[Rocko]

Originally posted by chrissilverm
ii know many executives, professionals, scholars, intellectuals, artists even a few cops who all enjoy using marijuana. dont get me wrong, there are also a lot of losers too! but i use marijuana almost everyday, and it has never been a problem, i have a great job, a nice apartment, a nice car, and hell, i even got me this nice SV.

what was i saying? damn canabinoids.

I don't think anyone was saying every user was a loser because I think we all probably know users who go to work everyday, do their jobs, etc. but rather, just like drinking, there is a time and a place for weed use, and it sounds like many think smoking while operating a motor vehicle is not the time and place.

blaze on, mang!

[o4trix]

Originally posted by Rocko
I don't think anyone was saying every user was a loser because I think we all probably know users who go to work everyday, do their jobs, etc. but rather, just like drinking, there is a time and a place for weed use, and it sounds like many think smoking while operating a motor vehicle is not the time and place.

blaze on, mang!

See, this is what I'm talking about... Two members are respecting each others opinions even if they dont agree and are getting along with one another. Why doesn't everybody take a lesson from these guys and get along, k? thanks love ya lots.
-Nick

[blndweasel]

yeah, I gotta say it's pretty cool that people have avoided an all out flame war here. I've been on other forums where a topic like this would end in a locked thread and kicked users.

On a side note, I just saw this linked off of slashdot:

http://www.vnh.org/PerformMaint/NAVMEDP-6410.pdf

It's a very interesting read by a couple of Naval Officers, one of them the lead instructor at Top Gun. The article outlines fatigue management for aviators, and one of the things they use to keep pilots from falling asleep is small doses of amphetamines. It's a good example of how properly dosing an otherwise dangerous illicit drug can yield performance-enhancing effects in high-pressure situations.

[Manx]

Originally posted by Rocko
I don't think anyone was saying every user was a loser because I think we all probably know users who go to work everyday, do their jobs, etc. but rather, just like drinking, there is a time and a place for weed use, and it sounds like many think smoking while operating a motor vehicle is not the time and place.

blaze on, mang!

That's a great point - thanks for keeping us on-topic. The question is about whether or not it's okay to mix smoking m.j. and riding, not about smoking m.j. in general. :angel:

[Rocko]

Originally posted by blndweasel
yeah, I gotta say it's pretty cool that people have avoided an all out flame war here. I've been on other forums where a topic like this would end in a locked thread and kicked users.

On a side note, I just saw this linked off of slashdot:

http://www.vnh.org/PerformMaint/NAVMEDP-6410.pdf

It's a very interesting read by a couple of Naval Officers, one of them the lead instructor at Top Gun. The article outlines fatigue management for aviators, and one of the things they use to keep pilots from falling asleep is small doses of amphetamines. It's a good example of how properly dosing an otherwise dangerous illicit drug can yield performance-enhancing effects in high-pressure situations.

This is exactly what i'm talking about. If weed helped performance in some way, the military would be using it. They want to perform their best, and can definitely get around the laws we normal folk are subject to, right?

[Mohawk]

Originally posted by chrissilverm
i actually have a clinical prescription for medical marijuana,

I thought the federal government shot that down. A buddy of mine was prescribed it as well, but all the shops in the area shut down when that federal law passed. From what i understood if he gets caught with it, the prescription means didly.

Just asking.

[Zombiesai]

Green cards(medicinal merijuana permits) are still good in Lovely Oregon. :D

As far as I know..none of my friends have been arrested for their legal and truly needed medicine.

[chrissilverm]

there are many pharmacies in socal that are open, and regulated. many in liberal west hollywood where i live.

[stingray]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dope

hm...i always considered "dope" to be hard drugs like heroin, coke, crystal, etc (looks like "dope" is marijuana only in the UK? :D)

FWIW, i've driven after a couple puffs and i can tell you it's worse to drive on grass since it messes w/ your vision a little more than just booze. at least for me.

[Willdahthril]

Originally posted by Dragonhawk
How much you wanna bet that most of these people who think it is okay to ride high are all single males under 30 with crewcuts?

It looks to me like this is a comment on the military using mj.


I wrote a huge reply to this and my comp went offline in the middle of the post and it was lost. Bottom Line: Good thread, definitely worth the read, alot of good points, many of which i agree with. In a nutshell, cannabis has a effects on the human body, some desireable, others not so desireable. i don't think it's any safer to ride high and the only argument for safety was "it made him very paranoid and extremely cautious behind the wheel, so he drove well, just extremely slow" and like hoolieb I'm always extremely cautious and paranoid about other drivers doing unpredictable things and most riders (though they may be squids) would say I'm exgtremely slow. for me it safety/survival first and fun second, so I'll stay away from mixing that stuff with my riding

[NukleoN]

You're right, it's not black and white, and that was my point. Unfortunately it's impossible to set limits and standards on something such as how "high" a person is.

With alcohol, it's relatively accurate to say 1 shot = 1 beer = 1 glass of wine, and if you've had more than a certain number, based on weight, that you are probably over the limit. Marijuana however varies in potency, so you can't say it's okay to take two puffs and drive because it's impossible to tell how much is in the person's system.

THis is a good point, and I'd be ok simply making it illegal to drive under the influence of Cannibus, but posessing or smoking it is another matter entirely...I don't think the state needs to get involved any more than they get involved with people who smoke other plants (such as tobacco). However, I do enjoy the fact that the state forces people sucking down smoke to stay away from non-smokers....not cool if I have to breathe their ridiculous drug habit if I am a captive audience.

In any event...probably best not to smoke pot and drive....bad combo. Just wait till you get to where you're going before enjoying the MJ....and bring snacks...but yeah...not something I would do or condone, but nothing wrong with those who want to smoke...just don't be driving under the influence of anything that can ruin your life or someone else's.