Micro Headlights

[rhino]

(I tried to search...but failed)

I am looking for the smallest and most compact headlights for a track bike. I am going to mount them under the front fairing. Can someone please provide me with a name and a place to purchase online.

With all the naked bikes here, someone should be able to point me in the right direction and save me a week of surfing the internet.

thanks in advance...rhino

[racinteach]

Pepboys has some small halogens that are small enough when you remove the outer ring..check them out..

[rhino]

Originally posted by racinteach
Pepboys has some small halogens that are small enough when you remove the outer ring..check them out..

Pepboys? Who ever knew? If this comment didn't come from you, I would have dismissed this as crack-headness. I will check it out.

[bloodclot]

just make sure that what you buy is marked as DOT certified "driving lamps".

fog lights have a more narrow beam and arent legal by them selves in most states.

[blong]

I just ordered one of these

http://www.rallylights.com/hella/50mm_modules.asp

A little pricey $106, but looks pretty cool, and dang it's small.

I'll let you know how it is when I get it next week.

I've done the pep boys fog light route. It's okay if just you want to pretend to be street legal, but they don't light anything up driving at night and are not legal by themselves.

[soulofadra6o]

Originally posted by blong


I've done the pep boys fog light route. It's okay if just you want to pretend to be street legal, but they don't light anything up driving at night and are not legal by themselves.

i agree...had some on my friends car and we tried driving at night with only the fog lights on...didnt really light up more than a foot or two infront of the car and barely anything on the sides

[kipmonchon]

I bought some lights at Kragen and mounted them to the radiator, there not projection, but I get two beams right on the ground in front, and I THINK it makes me more visible.

They also have a blue lens which matches my bike, i like it.

[racinteach]

Originally posted by rhino
Pepboys? Who ever knew? If this comment didn't come from you, I would have dismissed this as crack-headness. I will check it out. why thank you for the vote of confidence....I've only hit the pipe once this week...but yeah make sure you use a drving beam pattern ...also Lazer makes a very small light that we use off road quite often...should check them out..they are all over ebay..

[rhino]

Originally posted by blong
I just ordered one of these

http://www.rallylights.com/hella/50mm_modules.asp

A little pricey $106, but looks pretty cool, and dang it's small.

I'll let you know how it is when I get it next week.

I've done the pep boys fog light route. It's okay if just you want to pretend to be street legal, but they don't light anything up driving at night and are not legal by themselves.

I checked this out. Size is good. What do you do about HIGH beams? (I read that Hella only makes HIGH beam in HID)

What lights are on the bike in your Avatar?

[blong]

Originally posted by rhino
I checked this out. Size is good. What do you do about HIGH beams? (I read that Hella only makes HIGH beam in HID)

What lights are on the bike in your Avatar?

They sell the high beam low beam separate, so high beam means turn on the high beam light. I only want it for when I end up out late on my track/street bike, so I'm going low beam only.

In my avatar is when I had pep boys fog lamps.

[Dante]

Originally posted by bloodclot
just make sure that what you buy is marked as DOT certified "driving lamps".

fog lights have a more narrow beam and arent legal by them selves in most states.

From what I've read, driving lights are the long, narrow beam pattern, and fog lights are the short, dispersed, "close up" beam pattern. I think this may be what you meant to say, but isn't.

I've got 2 pair of "driving lights" right now (one set is Hella, the other is an off-brand). both seem to be really bright, and whichever look / shine better, I'll stick with for my dual headlight setup, if I can ever find the time to DO it... :( I think for the high beams I will relay a 3rd light in and have ALL 3 on for highs, just the 2 driving lights on for lows. The 3rd light will probably be oval shaped, mounted either above or below the 2 round driving (lo-beam) headlights. Relays are my friend! :D :cool:

[supernes550]

Originally posted by Dante
I think for the high beams I will relay a 3rd light in and have ALL 3 on for highs, just the 2 driving lights on for lows. The 3rd light will probably be oval shaped, mounted either above or below the 2 round driving (lo-beam) headlights. Relays are my friend! :D :cool:

how do you relay the third light in? do have schematics that you might be able to share? i'd like to see how that's done.

[Dante]

Well, so far it's all just in my head, but here's the idea.

The single bulb with dual filaments has 3 prongs. 1 for lo beam, 1 for hi beam, and 1 to complete the circuit. Thus, there are 3 wires going into the wiring harness for the lamp. Tap into this, and you have (logically) a wire that is hot for lo-beam, a wire that is hot for hi-beam, and a ground. The relay will get it's power directly from the battery, and for the lo-beam is pretty simple. I plan to put two 55W lights (round 4" lights) for the lo-beam to have a dual headlight setup. For the lo-beam, the relay has the battery line coming in (source voltage), and the "signal" wire of the normal lo-beam line discussed above. The output goes to the headlights. Whether to wire in parallel or series, I don't remember, I'll have to refer to my old electrical circuit analysis formulae to refresh myself (too late to have to think that hard atm).

So, for the lo-beams, you've got this, basically:

source voltage wire from battery & lo-beam signal wire | RELAY | lo-beam power wires (output)

The way the relay works is that the output wires are only hot when the lo-beam signal wire is hot. This effectively reduces the draw on the switch to just about nothing, so you don't burn it out if you pull more power than the stock lights do.

Now, question is, how do you get the hi-beam in the mix as well? With another relay, you pick up the same source voltage line from the battery, and the hi-beam "signal" wire, set it up pretty much like the lo-beam relay, and on the output you include all 3 lights, not just the 2 lo-beam lights. This does require that the relay be able to handle a pretty good amount of wattage, at least 165 I'm guessing, but that's 14 Amps. I have 40 Amp relays, so I could go up to about 500 Watts without a problem. The limiting factor here is the charging system on the bike, not the relays, and as long as you use adequate gauge wire, that won't be a problem either. I've got 0, 2, 4, 8, 12, and 14 guage wire around, so I am pretty sure I will not have a problem with trying to run too-thin of wires.

I realize this is all really muddled sounding, and you're thinking "this dude is gonna blow his shit up" but I do plan to actually sketch the diagram to make sure I don't blow mah shit to bits. Lights are too expensive for that! I will post the schematic in my gallery at some point. ;)

[racinteach]

nope been there done that...it will require two relays to do the low beqam high beam deal...however I have new toy that will allow you to only use one relay..I forgot whatit is called but bascially it will only allow voltage to travel in one direction...I had it so one light would turn on with the low switch and two would turn on with the high swtich...

[supernes550]

racinteach, will this new toy work with a 6 volt system by any chance? reason i ask is that i plan on using two round driving lamps and need to splice and rig up connections off of the wiring harness on my ysr and kinda wanted to do it the way dante is doing his set up.

[racinteach]

good question I beleive it will

[newbe]

its called a one way diode just make sure you get one that is stronge enough to handle the current.


Alex

[james4396]

the use of relays in lighting is to route the high amps ways from your ignition switch, light switch and onto a fused higher capacity wire.

without relays the ignition switch must handle all the current flow for every device ... starter, lights and such. That's way too much current for your little ignition switch and the wire harness. Wiring system without relays will have a greater propensity for burning out switches and wiring harnesses.

a 12 volt relay should be used on a 12 volt system only, buy a 6 volt relay if your antique bike needs a 6 volt relay

diodes ... that a whole chapter. rectifying, current limiting and voltage limiting diodes, light emitting, switching diodes ...

[Dante]

Damn this got complex in the last 24 hours. For reference, I barely got a B in my circuits lab. :D

Racinteach, tell us more about this toy you have! I don't want to have to jam 3 of these relays into a project box along with all the other wires. These relays I have are about 1 cubic inch a piece, plus the wiring pigtails. They are Bosch IIRC, made in Germany, supposed to be pretty high quality.

[racinteach]

the relays will still need to be used but maybe not as many....two at the most. That is the only way I could get my lights to work the way I wanted them to. Now with this one way diode...I will only require one relay versus two...relays should always be used ...funy thing is I managaed to find a pair of DOT stamped driving lights...hard to come by bu they are out there..Dante I will draw something up ..that I used...

[rhino]

This is getting crazy complex for me. It seems like I need to do a bunch more research and find someone who knows lighting prior to tackling the lighting job on the track bike.

[blong]

Originally posted by rhino
This is getting crazy complex for me. It seems like I need to do a bunch more research and find someone who knows lighting prior to tackling the lighting job on the track bike.

you really don't have to go relays as long as you keep it around stock output (55W I think). i ended up just 'borrowing' my girlfriend's bicycle light (which happens to use two 12V lights).

[soulofadra6o]

blong..how do those bicycle lights work for you? i've always wondered how the lighting would differ from smaller bulbs when fitting them onto a bike with race fairings

[Dante]

Originally posted by racinteach
the relays will still need to be used but maybe not as many....two at the most. That is the only way I could get my lights to work the way I wanted them to. Now with this one way diode...I will only require one relay versus two...relays should always be used ...funy thing is I managaed to find a pair of DOT stamped driving lights...hard to come by bu they are out there..Dante I will draw something up ..that I used...

Cool, I'd appreciate that. I am planning on making a run out to Fry's tomorrow (I know, the insanity!), I'll take a look at their diodes. Do you have any specs or info on the diodes you used? Thx

[blong]

Originally posted by HappyZero
Blong, while you may be able to get away without a relay for the lights, I would NOT recommend going without them for lighting applications. Even with a 55-Watt load, its a lot of current to switch (about 4.6 amperes at 12 Volts). Fortunately, lamps are primarily resistive loads (most filament-lamps are effectively resistors), and there's not an initial startup current spike when (that would be characteristic of a motor - e.g. the FI fuel pump).


doesn't all motorcycles come without relays? they seem to work alright.

Originally posted by soulofadra6o
blong..how do those bicycle lights work for you? i've always wondered how the lighting would differ from smaller bulbs when fitting them onto a bike with race fairings

Works okay. Not as bright as stock, and because the light pattern is basically a circle, you need to point them pretty low to avoid having them pointing up at cars in front of you.

They're very small and light, and allow me to not have to worry about going for a ride that lasts longer than the sunlight.

[Dante]

Originally posted by blong
doesn't all motorcycles come without relays? they seem to work alright.


I'd be really surprised if the lights on the SV didn't go through a relay, but the problem is that the stock relay isn't rated to handle much more than the load put on it by the factory lighting. As pointed out, that's probably a max of 10 Amps (about 120 watts, if you upgrade to a 55/100W bulb, or have 2 60W hi-beams in the case of the SVS). What we are proposing is possibly putting closer to 200 Watts or 20 Amps of power through that relay (if there is one at all). Instead of frying the factory electronics, it's safer to put a very low load on them and just use it as a switching circuit that feeds into a higher-power relay (the ones I have are 40 Amp rated), so I could go up to nearly 500W of lights, assuming I used the correct guage of wire for everything. The major limitation here is the charging system on the SV, once you put in your own relay and tap the power directly from the battery.

Moral of the story: If you aren't going to exceed the power of the stock headlamp, there is really no need to fuss with an extra relay and power run to the battery, as you won't exceed the rating in the factory headlight wiring. If you plan to exceed the factory lighting draw (which I plan to do), then you would be well advised to use a relay with a higher power capacity than the stock wiring. :cool:

[hi-vltg]

Holy thread reserection batman!!!

Anyway, the reason that I brought this back up to the top is to ask this.....

I'm planning on ditching that factory eye sore of a headlight off of my 02' naked and putting on 2 trail tech mini offroad lights....kinda like the lazerstars as mentioned above, but more durable. Not sure what wattage to go with....was thinking about a 55w for the low beam and maybe going with an HID for hi beam.
I'm not sure if the 55W is too much for a low beam, maybe go 35W instead??? HID is pretty damn bright, then not sure if I'm going to run into problems with the popo.

Oh yeah, here is a link to trailtech's choices http://www.trailtech.net/single_lights.html

[racinteach]

your stock lights are 55 watt low and 60 or 65 high depending on what bulbs you are using.. should handle the trail tech with no porblem

[JV711]

I would like to see those trail tech HID SCMR16 (30W, 1850 lumens) in person at night.

Well if you believe manufacturer marketing claims: (grossly mis-aimed lights here)
http://trailtech.net/light_comparison_photos.html

[ETRacing]

Be sure to get driving lights, not fog lights. Most of the packages will show you a light pattern. Buy the widest light pattern available in the size of light you want. I used a single autozone driving light on my RC51 "track bike" when I streeted it. It really needed 2 lights for night :grin: use.

[hi-vltg]

Well, just got off the phone with a motor-cop that I know. I was asking him about the legality issues of running "offroad" lights on the streets. He told me that the lights are supposed to be DOT approved for street use, but most time with motorcycles they don't mess with you....unless it's like a nuicisance or something. As long as it is properly aimed on the low beam, shouldn't be a problem.

So, got another call into another buddy of mine to get me a price on these two lights, and then it might be time to be out in the garage with the chopsaw and the welder:D

Keep you updated;)

[racinteach]

yeah I have seen the Trail tech's in person...they are very bright ...however very pricey for what you get as well...

[hi-vltg]

See, I've been involved in the off road community for years and years now. And when I saw an HID for $150 a light, that's cheap by those standards, but most HID's that we've delt with any where from $550 a light to around $250 light...but those are also 9" big too. Maybe your right though, but what are your suggestions then for an alternative light??

[racinteach]

If you can swing the trail tech's by all mean go for it..but there are also salvage yeards..look for the wrecked cars with HIDS..and put them in a housing ..I have been using the 4Wheel parts 5" lights for my light kits...DOTstamped...so no hassle and they can be upgraded...:D ..I run two on my dirtbike that are battery operated...good light output..

[CrowLaw]

Originally posted by blong
I just ordered one of these

http://www.rallylights.com/hella/50mm_modules.asp

A little pricey $106, but looks pretty cool, and dang it's small.

I'll let you know how it is when I get it next week.

I've done the pep boys fog light route. It's okay if just you want to pretend to be street legal, but they don't light anything up driving at night and are not legal by themselves.

Me likey.....:)

[newbe]

The LEDs are getting better every year. Now there are making a 5w LEDs that are about as bright as a 5 cell maglight. You can install 4-5 of those lights in a 2" by 2". I didnt have alot of time to trace down all the parts i need but im trying to find the circuit board for a voltage regulator. It has to maintain same voltage no matter the output on the charging system. If you run them somewhat hotter (higher voltage) the light output is awsome. Vibration has no effect on them and they would outlast your bike. i guess i should get on finding the regulator.

Alex

[newbe]

Im going to have some of the newest LEDs send to me soon. When i finish them up i would try and post some of the pics. See what you guys think about it. Unless i get distracted again :rolleyes: :rolleyes: .


Alex

[Dante]

Another cool thing about the LEDs is that you can be really creative with the packaging. You could setup a bank of like 50 of them in a diamond shape or oval or whatever and make for some really wicked looking headlamps (see auto show concept cars for examples). I know that LED headlights are right on the cusp of being commercially available on production cars. I'd love to put some on the front of my bike!

[ETRacing]

I'd definitely go with a high dollar setup like the Hella's. Several weeks ago we rode to the Honda Hoot, and my 99 with triple "pep boys" driving lights really didn't offer adequate lighting at night. Also, after the trip (wherein it rained on us for over 250 miles to the Hoot) the center light went out. I may end up back with the stock headlight. I know this won't work for your track bike. I did have a RC51 track bike that was streetable and these lights sufficed (using only one), as long as I DID NOT get caught in the dark.

[gliscameria]

I got some super bright haolgens from pepboys. Their mounting hardware sucks though.