The Future of General Aviation

[buymenow00]

Arrgghhh! I had just spent like 1/2 an hour typing up a looooong essay on the future of general aviation and how we're all going to be able to fly our own modern airplanes one day...then I hit "submit" and it errored out! Well, I for sure am not going to type that thing again...

[Burst]

Isn't it past your bedtime...... You've got a big day ahead of you. All of these hooligans are going to invade your place and never leave! :cool:

[ersigh]

Did you hit the back button? Sometimes it'll come back up when you do that .. (too late now i guess) ...

After dealing w/Yahoo mail I just got into the habit of copying my next before hitting send ...

[buymenow00]

Even the "go to" wouldn't get it back...oh well. But there are some really cool things happening with small airplanes right now...things that will make it easier for people to fly on their own...

[ersigh]

can i put wings on my bike?

[gizmo]

This is an old thread and thought I would bring it back for absolutely no reason :D

Enjoy

[buymenow00]

Uh...hello? Why is someone messing with me...I was happily dead.

Doesn't the notify function ever quit? Why doesn't someone bring back the very first post on the site and see what happens?

[SVSmiles]

Originally posted by buymenow00
Arrgghhh! I had just spent like 1/2 an hour typing up a looooong essay on the future of general aviation and how we're all going to be able to fly our own modern airplanes one day...
And here I thought the chap who if I recall correct lead me to this site some years back had returned...

The Future of
General Aviation!
http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_12_3.gif

[buymenow00]

Hey Miles...how're you doing? How's the bike? Yes, I certainly remember walking you through the fork mods...while you gave me advice on rear fender elimination. I also remember that your bike looked awesome!

Oh, and let's not forget the stripped oil pan plug!

[SVSmiles]

PMed U... ;)

[NukleoN]

Smilies did you buy Mike's bike? Mike how is the scooter doing?

[gizmo]

See there I did something good for a change :D Mike may I ask why you were doing a paper for General Aviation?

[SVSmiles]

Originally posted by NukleoN
Smilies did you buy Mike's bike?
Negative on that. ;) IF I remember correct back in the day when my former web site was starting up he found it and was inspired by the projects posted (particularly the no-cost Rear Fender Elm Project) and made an effort to contact me (via email) to make me aware of this site and pointed me to a thread that had already been started discussing the web site. I was surprised and happy to see some of those using the site back then, because at that time everyone was merely a page counter hit # to me. Mike was a welcomed advocate and I'm glad he lead me to this site (forums) as I now pretty much make it my SV/S forum home.

PS: I'll BRB to your PM as soon as I get caught up on some work here. ;)

[buymenow00]

Mike may I ask why you were doing a paper for General Aviation?

Hey Giz - I'm a licensed pilot, so I'm interested in all things related to flying. When I started flying a few years ago, I was shocked at what was considered state of the art in small planes...basically 1950's technology!! Anyway, the trend that's picking up momentum right now is to bring general aviation up to date...and that means simpler and safer to fly. That's what I was writing about...

Hey Nukester, did you ever do that Discovery Flight??

[bling_thing]

I soloed in a Cessna 150 a million years ago.

Can we all have BD5 jets now?

[gizmo]

One day when I can afford it I will try and at least finish my Private Pilot. Wow bling didnt know Cessna made a 150 back before the big JC. :grin:
Mike do you actually fly for a living or is just for recreation?

[bling_thing]

For future professional pilots, I read an interesting article. The FAA is going full tilt into building thousands of smaller hub airports with the idea of having many smaller planes and shorter routes between hubs.

Instead of a hundred people flying out of Omaha, they would fly out of more local fields for shorter hops.

Instead of a mass gang bang like LAX, you could fly out of Santa Monica or Van Nuys. The terminals would be smaller, cozier, friendlier.

Honda, for instance, is making a small fuel effecient jet JUST for this new market.

What this means is pilots would be needed for smaller aircraft..like corporate Lear pilots now. You may not make the big bucks anymore, but you would at least get a job!

Big terminals would still be used for long hauls, but short haul traffic would be shuffled to smaller fields.

Exciting stuff!

[gizmo]

That would be nice...no more long stays over night :)

[buymenow00]

I learned to fly just for fun...always wanted to do it. I highly recommend it!! Very challenging, but great when you do it right! You can do a $49 demo Discovery Flight at most flight schools by printing out the coupon from www.BeAPilot.com. At the very least you can get a cool 45 minute flight where you actually get to fly the plane...you could get hooked, that's how it happened to me. Didn't hurt that my flight instructor was a hot blonde named Trisha either...

My original essay also touched on the subject that bling brought up...less emphasis on the regional hubs to route traffic through. There are far more small general aviation airports than there are the larger hubs served by the major airlines, so theoretically you should be able to arrive closer to your destination. There are three major obstacles to overcome...1) efficient processing and booking of passengers - jets cost a lot to run, even when they are still on the ground, so you need to fill the plane with everyone that wants to go to a specific place at the same time - not that easy to do, but you only need to worry about 6-12 passengers in a small jet, 2) only the larger general aviation airports have some organized ground transportation: rental cars, taxis, etc..., and 3) in the post 9/11 world it could be argued that smaller airports are potentially weak links in the security net for air travel.

OK, I'm rambling now...I didn't even get to the part about "affordable" and easy to fly jets that are coming soon...

[gizmo]

Well I started my Private when I was in Okinawa and got right at 15 hours then when I got back to the states I started back and ended up running out of money after only a couple of flights so I only have about 17 or 18 hours. I am really hoping that I will be able to finish it but I can't justify it right now since I need to go to school before I get out of the Corps. Then I can spend the money to finish flying..of course I will probably have to start back as square one :( more money but more flying :D ....anyway..you are right about security in the smaller regional airports but as the airport increases in size the revenue generated will also increase by companies and by customers so funding will get bigger, so you can increase your security. After working on helicopters for 9 years I can almost say that part of my blood is hydraulic fluid, head oil, transmission fluid and mostly electrons (im an AVI guy) plus a little tar mack and flight deck..now you got me rambling on:D

[sandie]

buymenow!!!! wow, i was just gonna recommend to someone to remove your SN from the registry ;) KIDDING!

[Burst]

HOLY CRAP! buymenow posted!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

How the hell you been man?!?!

[bling_thing]

Here's the info on the new jet they are building:

http://world.honda.com/news/2003/c031216_2.html

[cyclox]

What about these? Still sort of vaporware, but tres cool indeed.


http://www.moller.com/skycar/


http://www.sparkdesign.nl/actueel/20041013palv/20041013press.html


edit: hmm, the moller link is flakey. here's another report:

http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/futuristic/the-moller-skycar-forty-years-and-70-million-later-a-flying-car-027596.php

[bling_thing]

I've been reading about the Moller for years, buut the other one I've never heard of. The Moller looks clunky, ut the Spark doodad look very interesting!

Cruises at 125...that'll get you there!

[buymenow00]

Hey Sandie & Gregg - I'm doing fine, just been pretty busy at work and the usual crap...hope you two are doing well.

If you're interested in stuff that is less vapor than the Moller Skycar...check out these links:

Diamond Air - D-Jet (http://www.diamondair.com)
Eclipse Aviation (http://www.eclipseaviation.com)
Aviation Technology Group (http://www.avtechgroup.com/)
Maverick Jets (http://www.maverickjets.com/)
and
Viper Aircraft (http://www.viper-aircraft.com/)

All of these companies have actual prototypes flying or are very near that point...I'm putting my money on Diamond Air since they already make a whole bunch of prop planes (I learned to fly in one!), and they have a very good track record of getting new models to market quickly...

The HondaJet has a lot of people buzzing about it, but I don't know of any firm production plans. Toyota is also working on a new piston aircraft engine for small planes...

Cheers!

[bling_thing]

Wow...the Diamond jet is in the Lear performance range.

I wondered what that trainer was! I see one at the end of Van Nuys field. Is that where you took lessons?

It's got much better stats than the Cessna 150 I see...

[planetom]

The Honda project has actually been around for 10 years or so in various forms. They aren't admitting to any production plans for the airplane itself, but they have been pretty tight-lipped about things like that in the past. They have entered a partnership with G.E. to finish development, certification, and production of the turbofan engine in that plane. There is also a joint project with Continental for a new aircraft piston engine, but I haven't heard where they are on that.

Toyota has been in airplane projects for a while also. Several years ago they did get an aircraft version of a Lexus V-8 certified, but it never went into production. They were doing flight tests when I worked at Mojave airport in the early 90's. There have been rumors of a toyota 4-seat airplane for a while, but I haven't seen anything of it.
Some of the japanese companies are suprisingly diversified conglomerates. If I remember correctly, Kawasaki Heavy Industries builds everything from supertankers to military helicopters and fighters.

In the other small jets, Eclipse seems to be the farthest along at this point, with Diamond right in there close. The only thing that may hold back the Diamond is that it is single engine. There has long been a resistance to singles at the high performance end of things, but there are several single engine turboprops that have broken the ice, so it may do okay. I hope so, I like their planes. They have a new twin engine diesel that should do very well.

[buymenow00]

Bling -
I trained in a Diamond Katana/Eclipse:

http://www.ottawaflighttraining.com/images/C1e.jpg

Very cool aircraft, composite construction, bubble canopy, and stick controls. Compared to a Cessna 150/152, this thing is the Starship Enterprise!!

There is a Diamond dealer at Van Nuys, so I'm not surprised that you see them there. I actually learned to fly out of Torrance.

[bling_thing]

The visability must be awesome.

After getting used to NO ground affect with a 150 high wing, I found it difficult to get used to the low wing of the Piper 140.

Did you feel an extra "cushion" being a problem on your landings? I felt that the same nose up attitude that I had with the 150 didn't work for shit with the 140. The 150 would just plop on the runway with no surprises, but the 140 would keep wanting to fly! I was always yanking the nose up higher to bleed off airspeed, and having these 2 bounce landings. I quit lessons before I ever got the hang of it.

That Diamond is so sexy, it makes me want to go blow a bunch of money again!

[buymenow00]

Wow, it has been the exact opposite for me transitioning to a Cessna 172...damn ground effect was so strong and with those big flaps it didn't want to land! Had to get used to more nose up than the Katana ever needed.

The Katana is actually pretty easy to land...but that being said, it took me a solid month of flying - and thinking that I would never get the hang of it - before I could grease my landings with a satisfying "erk-erk" sound of the main gear touching down. As you probably know by now, most of the basics of flying isn't really that difficult: taxiing, taking off and flying can be picked up fairly quickly by many people. The things that I found are tough are radio communications, navigation (before GPS!) and LANDING!

I really like the Katana, maybe you can swing by Van Nuys and take a $49 Discovery Flight, see how you like it. Keep in mind though that if you're much over 6' tall, you may not be too comfortable...and yes, you are right, the visibility is awesome!

[bling_thing]

ooooh! I didn't know you were still taking lessons! Maybe we can hook up and I'll pay half the gas sometime!

The $49 flight sounds mighty tempting! I work on Hayvenhurst right next to the airport, the school is walking distance.

Saw a P-51 roar out last week...sounded fabulous, and was as quick heading out as a Lear.

Of course my F4i will be out of the shop with a replaced temp sensor tomorrow, and I won't need an airplane fix as bad!

Warranty is covering the sensor...for some reason I got a bad one.

[buymenow00]

No more lessons for me...though I do believe that flying is a "license to learn"! I got my private ticket for VFR about 3 years ago...

I wanted to continue on for IFR, but that would be another year and $10,000...plus you have to fly pretty often to stay proficient on the instruments!

All this talking of flying is definitely making me want to get back up there...probably haven't flown since last May!

[bling_thing]

Flying is a bottomless pit to throw money into. After several afternoons of flying back to the field and hardly being able to find it in all the smog, I realized I would kill myself without an instrument rating. More money...more time. It was getting too expensive, so I quit. Just wanted the satisfaction of soloing!

Stil love airplanes though.